- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

August 20, 2007

The plot thickens ...

The plot surrounding the genesis and the content of Walter Haut's 2002 affidavit continues to thicken.

After speaking with Stanton over the weekend, I contacted Dennis Balthaser again to discuss any differences between the Balthaser/Connors 2000 video interview with Walter Haut and Haut's 2002 affidavit. The principal issue for me, as well as for Stanton, was finding some extrinsic evidence to verify that Ramey and DuBose showed up at the Roswell staff meeting on July 8, 1947, where the coverup plot was laid out to the officers at the 509th.

Was Walter Haut's 2002 affidavit the first mention of Ramey's presence at that meeting? Dennis said that Walter had mentioned this fact in his 2000 video interview along his with his statement that he had seen the bodies. And in response to criticism that he had sandbagged Walter with questions that were not supposed to be asked about his involvement in the Roswell incident, Dennis replied that he had submitted his questions in advance of the interview so there were no surprises.

But rather than paraphrase what Dennis said, I'll just attach his own statement along with the transcript of what was asked and answered at that interview. Then I'll go back to writing my article on this subject for the September issue. This issue, if I can follow up on one major story, will be a doozy.

David Rudiak is summing up what appears in the transcript of the Balthaser/Connors interview of Walter Haut, recorded on video, in 2000:

Just for the record, below is my transcript of the relevant portions of the 2000 oral interview concerning Ramey at Roswell and Haut seeing a body and craft in a hangar. Afterwards, I'll compare it with the 2002 affidavit.

As can be seen in the transcript, Wendy Connors (abbreviated as WC) is asking questions based on her understanding of previous comments by Haut. So Wendy does most of the talking and Haut comes off as a somewhat taciturn, reluctant respondent to these particular probes by Wendy. I got the impression that he deliberately did not want to respond in detail, but he did confirm what Wendy was asking him and certainly did not deny it.

WC: The next day Roger Ramey and Dubose, his aide, comes to Roswell. As you have told me in previous interviews, you all gathered in the conference room -- Blanchard was there, Ramey, Dubose, you, and several others -- but you have never gone into detail on what was discussed, other than you did tell me that General Ramey wanted this thing stopped. And the last time we talked, when I asked you if this was a real flying saucer, if this was a real body, you said yes, that Roger Ramey lied, it was not a weather balloon. Do you remember what the discussion was in the conference room? Was Ramey upset with Colonel Blanchard? Or did they just kind of put all their heads together and say this is the best way to put the stop to this information?
HAUT: I wasn't privy to a lot of the information that went back and forth between Ramey and Blanchard. I would assume that when they got together they discussed this, with nobody else around, and decided that the best way to do that is this. Let's get the news media in here and let's just tell them our side of it, and let it go at that.
WC: Let me get back to -- you're all in the conference room, and Ramey's there, Dubose is there, obviously Colonel Blanchard had been talking on the phone to General Ramey over that evening, and the next day Ramey and Dubose show up, and as you said, you were all in the conference room. Was it in the conference room that Ramey decided to deny that this was a flying disc and it was a weather balloon? Was the cover story done there in the conference room?
HAUT: The fact that I was the public relations officer and involved with this, I felt that I had to pay a lot of attention. When you're a first lieutenant and here's a general here, and there's a couple of colonels there, and lieutenant colonels over there, and you're sitting here, the only field-grade officer, you kinda feel about that big!
WC: Well, I can understand that, but I want to get inside you. I think if I was the PIO and Colonel Blanchard had told me to release this story, and then all of a sudden here are the big boys with stars on their shoulders showing up, you're all in the conference room, and you know that you're going to have to pay attention, just like you said, to what they're saying and what they want because the public relations part that comes from it is going to come back on you and you're the one who's going to have to be answering the questions, through the media. Not much came, because obviously, as we know from history, it was pretty much dropped at that point. But you had to be prepared for that. So that's what I'm asking and assuming that there is where, in the conference room, you're all in there, and Ramey is discussing this is how we're going to kind of keep this very quiet so that higher authority can handle it. Is that what happened?
HAUT: Pretty much so. I couldn't find anything to nitpick on it.
WC: When I was here a few months ago, when the French film crew was here, where we talked about the saucer itself, the disc, the flying disc itself, and the body. At that time you told me that you had not observed the body up close, that you were -- you felt you were about 20 feet away from it, that the body was partially covered with a tarp, and it was next to the disc, the saucer itself. I have two questions. One, was the disc in so many different pieces or was it pretty much all together, but maybe broken in pieces? When you observed the disc, what did it look like?
HAUT: I would venture a guess that probably a diameter of somewhere around 25 feet.
WC: But even though you didn't go right up to the body, I'm assuming from what you told me, as you weren't close enough to smell the body, but that you were probably, to the best of your recollection, you were within approximately 20 feet of the body, which isn't really not that great of a distance. There's two parts to this question. One, there was only one body? What did that body look like?
HAUT: It was a relatively small body, comparable to ah, oh maybe an eleven-year-old, ten or eleven-year-old child. It was pretty well beat up.
WC: To make sure I've got this from a historical perspective, this is just two point-blank questions. First, you're saying that the recovery of the body, there was only one?
HAUT: (Long pause) I don't think so. (pause) I thought there were several bodies.
WC: When you saw the body in the hangar partially covered with the tarp, you only saw the one.
HAUT: Yes.
WC: OK. Now my next point-blank question is, and you had already told me this before, that, and you looked right at me and you said, "Hey, Roger Ramey lied. This was no weather balloon!" And you were very implicit about that. From the best of your recollection, they had a disc. And maybe it was in several pieces, but altogether laying there was approximately 20, 25 feet in diameter. This was not scattered from pillar to post. They had instrumentation. They really had a disc!
HAUT: That's my remembrance.
WC: But overall, you're very comfortable with -- you saw one body and this disc object.

HAUT: Yes.

(?? more like a mumbled affirmation)

WC: That you know. There's no question in your mind. That's fine.

(Goes on to asking questions about knowing Major Marcel.)

There are some differences with the 2002 affidavit, which also went into more detail, but nonetheless in 2000 Haut did verbally confirm key points about seeing a small body next to the craft and Ramey and chief of staff Dubose being at Roswell discussing the cover-up.

Key differences were the affidavit having Haut seeing "a couple of bodies" instead of one and giving different dimensions for the craft. In 2000 he guesses it may have been 25 feet in diameter, but the affidavit has it as "12 to 15 feet in length, not quite as wide, about 6 feet high, and more of an egg shape." Haut doesn't provide a shape in his interview, though Wendy Connors kept referring to it as a disc. It was unclear whether the craft was intact or broken into pieces.

Carey and Schmitt have several other witnesses describing a smaller, egg- or oval-shaped craft, including a number of civilians seeing the covered object being driven on a flat-bed truck through the center of Roswell on the afternoon of July 8. Since Don Schmitt apparently drafted the affidavit based on what he says were Haut's various comments to him over the years (with Haut carefully reviewing and then signing it with Schmitt not present), an important question in my mind is whether Haut actually gave this description to Schmitt or whether Schmitt based it on the other witnesses. Alternatively, maybe Haut in 2000 was deliberately not being fully candid about what the craft looked like. Nonetheless, in both interview and affidavit, Haut confirms a craft being recovered and seeing it, regardless of shape or dimensions.

Then there is the discrepancy between one body and several. Haut told Connors that it was his understanding that there were several bodies, but when Wendy pressed him about the actual number that he personally saw, Haut confirms that he only saw one. However, again, regardless of the number he personally saw, Haut is saying in both interview and affidavit that he was a body eyewitness. In both he describes the size as about that of a 10-year-old child.

Thus the main point remains that Haut was claiming to be a body/craft and cover-up eyewitness (with Ramey at the base at a meeting with Haut present) going back to at least 2 years before the 2002 affidavit.

Thanks, David and Dennis and Wendy for these revelations. The coverup at Roswell is unraveling before our very eyes, albeit sixty years later.

For my take on this, check out our September issue.

Bill Birnes

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

|

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

yesterday August tomorrow

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Want to exchange links?

click here!

Google
Web UFO

- - - - - email - - - - -